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<  FAN SECTION  ~  The Monsters of Rock

PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 3:40 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
Hey everyone,

On my way to work today I was listening to Motorhead, Judas Priest and Iron Maiden and thinking about Pulp City. This led me to thinking about how cool it would be to have a Heavy Metal / Rock Band Supreme Team so I came up with a few ideas - this is all quite vague so far, but I wanted to post it to see what people thought of the idea.

Here are my initial ideas

The Iron Priests are a band from the golden era of Heavy Metal (think Maiden/Priest Sabbath etc) they've been touring for years and have fallen on hard times as music tastes have changed and moved away from their sound. In a bid to resurrect their career, they decide to pull one big stunt - they're going to play a midnight gig on "Black Sabbath" i.e the Sunday that falls on All Hallows Eve (Halloween) and they're going to play in the most occult venue they can find - on top of Stone Henge!
As the band's sound blasts out, and they play their acclaimed hit "Sonata of Slaughter" they unwittingly begin to play the same rythm as an ancient druidic hym, used to cast ancient spells. As the song blares, mystical energy starts to swirl around the band and they're caught up in a blast of arcane magic, with Stonehenge acting as an amplifier, the unrestrained power of the Gaia transfoms the band into the "Monsters of Rock"

(Level 1 Support)
Lead Singer Mikaela Hyle aka Wail, known for his powerful vocal range is transformed into a wailing Banshee - he becomes imbibed with the power to use his voice as a Sonic weapon, and to sing melodies that resonate with his band members and enhance their performance.
Wail would have high :AGL and :MND with really low :STR and :ENG average :DEF and :SPT and would posibly be spectral/ have flight 1

(Level 2 Blaster)
Guitarist Tommy Rive aka Shred grows an extra arm, and his twin-necked guitar "Jezebeth" is possessed by a powerful spirit. Tommy can use his guitar, playing riffs and licks to blast out and damage his enemies. "Jezebeth" is a unique resource and enhances Mikkels abilities. Has an attack called "Heavy Metal Thunder"
Shred would have quite high :ENG and :AGL with low :STR & :DEF and average :SPT

(Level 2 Bruiser)
Drummer Johan Streike aka Thrash mutates into a Hulk Like brute, and gains supreme strength allowing hm to drum his oponents into the ground. he uses massive "Clubsticks" as weapons
Thrash would have High :STR and :DEF with quite low :MND & :AGL and average :SPT

I'm kinda seeing them as Hero's posibly Hero/Villains who tour the world rocking out and kicking ass! very much stialised to fit in with 70's metal so lots of big hair, leather and metal studs

what do you guys think of these initial ideas? Even if they're not great i REALLY hope we get some musicians as supremes, that would just be swet :D


Last edited by GreyLamb on Fri Jul 20, 2012 1:05 pm, edited 2 times in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 5:49 pm
User avatarPulp City IconPosts: 1819Location: Cornwall, UKJoined: Fri Aug 12, 2011 8:22 pm
Awesome ideas.
I would love to see these as a new team.



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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:26 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
I really like this concept, though I have to admit, I kept imagining Spinal Tap, especially once Stonehenge was involved... Musician supremes are a great idea!

So, any groupies as exclusive minions?


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 6:50 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
yeah I had spinal tap in mind when I was writing the fluff, so you've got me on that one! it would work as well with any other religious holy ground like a church or something but I thought Stonehenge sounded cool and keeps in line with the medieval edge to most classic metal.
groupie minions would be awesome, it would be ace to see the monsters of rock fighting evil backed up by an army of screaming fans!

I'm thinking they'd all be nature origins, and Indy but they could also be part of the forgotten as they are linked to ancien magic and spirits. however I don't see them as villains so maybe not forgotten unless they stop being an all villain faction


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:12 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
GreyLamb wrote:
yeah I had spinal tap in mind when I was writing the fluff, so you've got me on that one! it would work as well with any other religious holy ground like a church or something but I thought Stonehenge sounded cool and keeps in line with the medieval edge to most classic metal.
groupie minions would be awesome, it would be ace to see the monsters of rock fighting evil backed up by an army of screaming fans!

I'm thinking they'd all be nature origins, and Indy but they could also be part of the forgotten as they are linked to ancien magic and spirits. however I don't see them as villains so maybe not forgotten unless they stop being an all villain faction


Groupies: It would indeed be a great visual. The trick would be finding a useful role for them to play. I can't see the average rock fan being able to stand toe to toe with a hired gun or a ninja.

Origin: Remember that even if they're all given their powers from the same source, how they interact with that power may differ. That would mean they don't all have to be nature if you don't want. The advantage of having supremes of different origin in the same team is that when you field them, you've got a little more tactical choice in terms of who you might choose for a particular action.

Faction: Independant would be fine, but I would steer clear of an established faction. Each of the factions already has goals and members nad it may be tough to perfectly match up your new team with the existing guys. Instead, you might want to create a new faction called The Monsters of Rock. This would allow you to tailor some of your powers to specifically buff or affect your fellow team mates.


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PostPosted: Thu Jul 19, 2012 7:42 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
cardboardvampire wrote:

Groupies: It would indeed be a great visual. The trick would be finding a useful role for them to play. I can't see the average rock fan being able to stand toe to toe with a hired gun or a ninja.

Origin: Remember that even if they're all given their powers from the same source, how they interact with that power may differ. That would mean they don't all have to be nature if you don't want. The advantage of having supremes of different origin in the same team is that when you field them, you've got a little more tactical choice in terms of who you might choose for a particular action.

Faction: Independant would be fine, but I would steer clear of an established faction. Each of the factions already has goals and members nad it may be tough to perfectly match up your new team with the existing guys. Instead, you might want to create a new faction called The Monsters of Rock. This would allow you to tailor some of your powers to specifically buff or affect your fellow team mates.


i think the groupies would play some sort of support role for the supremes - something like as long as they are in the supremes command range the supreme benefits from some kind of bonus - as if the fans are boosting their egos and spurring them on. Maybe something different for each member of the band, say +1 :ENG for Shred +1 :STR for Thrash and +1 :MND for Wail? rather than being directly useful as an offensive force they'd be more of a buffing resource possibly? how does that sound?
Alternativley the groupies could be Hells Angels brawler types - similar to the corrupt cops / hired guns but beefy hand to hand fighters instead

and with regards to the origins your probably right and i don't think it would be too far fetched to make each member of the band a different origin - Shred = Science due to his use of Jesebeth his possessed electric guitar, and dependence on ranged combat blasts Thrash = Nature as he's just a brut who uses himself as a weapon and Wail = Mystery as he's a bit of an ethereal Banshee type.

I'd be happy for them just to be a mini Indy team rather than part of a faction, would be cool to think of them as they're own little faction.

Thinking about it this would make an AWESOME starter box!


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 12:45 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
I've been thinking about this after reading through the feedback so far and i've decided to make a few changes.
1 I think Wail should be a female - this would add a bit of gender variety to the team, and i thik a female fits better the the models fluff and role. Although this does mean ANOTHER level 1 female support supreme I would hope this wont be an issue.

2 Thrash wont have mutated hammer hands, just super strenght so he can use massive clubs as drumsticks - i think this gives a bit more realism to the character, and keeps him more human which i think is a good thing.

I've also mocked up the front of the cards using the Blank files on the forum and the Hero Creater as i'm no good at illustration. Any feedback regarding tweaking the numbers or changing the skills is welcomed.

WAIL

Image
Wail Front by jtlamby, on Flickr

I chose Annoying, Flight 3 and Spectral to represent the Banshee form of Wail, able to fly around the battlefield Singing her piercing songs and harrasing enemy supremes - i've made her very fragile in CC though, so it balances out that when she is caught she goes down!

SHRED

Image
Shred Front by jtlamby, on Flickr

Powerful Rays links with a ranged attack i'm thinking of giving Shred
Power Chord :ENG vs :MND AP2 Range 6
all supremes damaged by the Power Chord are also knocked down.

I like the image this skill brings up of Shred blasting out a note and knocking people of their feet.

leader fo Minions relates to the groupies i mentioned earlier - it seems natural that the cool guitarist will be able to command his loyal fans around

THRASH

Image
Thrash Front by jtlamby, on Flickr

Thrash is fairly simple - an out and out Brawler! I think Fury 2 represents his high tempo percusion "drumming" the enemy and reach is a nice way to represent his Clubsticks. I'm not sure about Heavy Gear, but i put it in as a way of preventing Thrash using his high :STR to make ranged attacks via scenery manipulation - i think he should just be a toe-to-toe kinda guy.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 2:17 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
Very cool prototypes. Are those made with hero machine?

At first glance, it's hard to get a good sense of if something is balanced without seeing the associated powers and especially the team power. That said, there's a few things I noticed.

First off, you're mentioning that you're trying to balance Wail by giving her low melee scores. That said, you've also given her permanent spectral, which means that melee is rarely, if ever, going to be an issue since spectral models are entirely immune to :STR based actions. As it stands now, if you also consider her :AGL of 4 (5 when flying) and a :SPT of 6, this character is going to be very, very hard to take down. You might instead consider instead that she has a power that gives her spectral.

Second, Heavy Gear for Thrash is a great idea. It very much makes sense (since he's holding two clubs).

Time to start thinking about powers, especially the team powers!

Update: For Wail, it's also interesting that you gave her both :MND of 6 and :SPT of 5. That tends to be on the higher side for a level 1 supreme. It's not unprecedented, Hoodoo has similar stats, but with an AP of 5, you want to keep an eye on her to make sure he's not too overpowered.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 3:09 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
cardboardvampire wrote:
First off, you're mentioning that you're trying to balance Wail by giving her low melee scores. That said, you've also given her permanent spectral, which means that melee is rarely, if ever, going to be an issue since spectral models are entirely immune to :STR based actions. As it stands now, if you also consider her :AGL of 4 (5 when flying) and a :SPT of 6, this character is going to be very, very hard to take down. You might instead consider instead that she has a power that gives her spectral.


you've got a point there - i dont want to lower her :MND or :SPT as they are essentially her main features, so I think taking Permenant Spectral off would probably be a good idea.

and yeah they're all made with hero machine - not exactlly how i imagine them in my head, especially Shred as he needs to be playing Jezebeth not just holding her but its an awesome programme to get a basic idea of the characters.

I've thought of a few individual powers so far, but not really nailed the Team Powers - thats deffo proving a sticking point. I think each member having a team powere related to their roll in the band would be cool - for example Thrash is the rythm section and keeps everything going to a regular beat, Wail is the frontwoman and Shred is the creative heart of the band - just not quite sure how to work it yet.

As a basic idea here are the ideas i've come up with so far:

WAIL
should have some kind of ranged "Shriek" as her basic offensive spell, possibly :SPT vs :MND i think it should be against :MND instead of :AGL as the shriek wont me physical but sonic and not something you can dodge. maybe something like:
Primal Scream (PR :SPT Vs. :MND /Rng 4/AP2)
Wail uses her high pitched falsetto to pierce the ears of enemy supremes.

Also I'm thinking she needs some kind of Debuff spell, maybe something to protect her in combat, possibly:
Siren Song (AU4 :MND /AP2)
As Wail sings her Siren song, all enemy supremes in the Aura become confused and disorientated. Enemy supremes within the Aura suffer -2 to all Opposed Rolls. Siren lasts until WAIL perofrms another action or takes damage.

next would be some kind of buff for her team mates - like providing them with additional benefits but I'm not sure what to do with this yet.
and for the final power i'm not really sure!


Shred
obviously Shred relies heavily on ranged combat so the first two powers would be offensive ranged attacks
Seek and Destroy (PR :ENG Vs. :AGL /Rng 8/AP2)
Shred strikes a massive Power Chord sending out a blast of energy

Symphony of Destruction (R :ENG vs :AGL /Rng 6/AP2)
As Shred plays the Symphony of Sestruction, a wave of Sonic Energy is released, and all enemies caught in its path are blown away. Any Enemy Supreme that takes damage from Symphony of Destruction is also Knocked down.

next up is a power to help Shred in combat, but also because I think the names cool!
Heavy Metal Thunder (SBL3 :ENG vs :DEF AP3 )
The feedback from Shreds guitar creates a massive electrical discharge, surrounding shred with a deadly lightning storm. All mechanical/construct supremes and minions caught in the blast suffer an additional damage point.

not sure of the last power yet, maybe another ranged attack?

This power is one that I think would be awesome if worked out properly but im not 100% on the specifics yet - I think this would probably work as his TEAM POWER
Sonata of Slaughter* ( :SPT AP6)
Shred beigns to play the same ancient druidic hym that transformed the Monsters of Rock - calling forth the unstoppable magic of nature. surrounded by a whirling vortex of Energy Shred gains Immovable and Invinvible 3. For every Game Round that Shred continues to play the Sonata of Sluaghter, supremes from the Monsters of Rock gain +1 to their opposed rolls. If Shred takes damage while playing the Sonata of Slaughter, he immediatley stops and all bonuses are lost.

I'll write up Thrash when I get a second, but needless to say he'll work in a very similar way to hellsmith with Several :STR vs :DEF based melle attacks


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 4:21 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
Heromachine: It's a fun tool, and it's easy to use for simple prototypes. You may also want to consider City of Heroes. While the gameplay is limited, it's free to play, and the character creator allows you to do some really cool stuff.

For the skills: You've got a solid start and you have a really good vision of what you want, which will make it easier.

What I'd suggest is take a look at existing powers and use them as templates, at least at the start.

For example, Wail has:

Siren Song (AU4 /AP2)
As Wail sings her Siren song, all enemy supremes in the Aura become confused and disorientated. Enemy supremes within the Aura suffer -2 to all Opposed Rolls. Siren lasts until WAIL perofrms another action or takes damage.

This is an incredibly powerful ability. Contrast it with a similar power which is used by Sanguine:

Horror (SBL 4 :MND vs :SPT /AP2)
No damage is dealt. Affected Living models that failed their opposed roll suffer -2 penalty to all rolls while modles rolling 1 on the opposed roll may not activate. The penalties last until the end of the round.

Note the differences. The AU is in effect for a lot longer than the self blast. In addition, your aura doesn't allow an opposed roll to resist.

As another example, look at Shred's

Symphony of Destruction (R vs /Rng 6/AP2)
As Shred plays the Symphony of Sestruction, a wave of Sonic Energy is released, and all enemies caught in its path are blown away. Any Enemy Supreme that takes damage from Symphony of Destruction is also Knocked down.

Contrast this with Guerilla's Raze:

Raze (R :ENG vs :AGL/RNG 4/ AP3)
Every model suffering at least 1 point of damage is knocked down and Raze travels even if it fails to inflict damage on a previous target.

You can ignore the italicized part, since I think that all rays do that in the new rules.

Let's contrast though. Symphony has a larger range and cheaper cost.

You've got a fantastic start with very thematic characters but I'd suggest taking a look at some of the existing supremes to get a sense of the baseline. No reason that a character can't have a better power than existing supremes, but the idea is to maintain balance.


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:00 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
Hmm i did have a quick look at some of the other supremes powers and tried to balance the powers, but looking at the examples you've give i guess i still need to work on them a bit.

Maybe reduce Wails Aura power - to any model activating within the aura must make a :MND vs :SPT opposed roll or suffer -1 to all rolls? give them a chance to avoid the sirens song. maybe even add the sirens song cannot effect mechanical supremes as they won't fall for it?

also with Shreds Ray attack maybe bring it up to 3AP to mach guerliia's Raze?

thinking about Wails stats, I could possibly drop the :MND down to 4 rather than 5 and just keep the high numbers in :SPT to stop her being overpowered - maybe even drop her AP to 4 but i think 4 might be a bit restrictive

what do you think of Shred's Team Power? do you think it makes sense and would be good? i like the idea of him just wailing on his guitar in the background, acting as a lightning rod for the druidic power and helping out his bandmates


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PostPosted: Fri Jul 20, 2012 8:59 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
At a certain point, and we may be reaching that point, you need a real expert on this stuff and that would be one of the guys like Beermonkey or PulpCitizen. They know what really goes into building solid, effective and well balanced supremes. I love this theory stuff, but I'm purely an amateur.

When you're balancing powers, it'll really help if you look at the supreme as a whole. Figure out what you want each power to do, and only then start to nitpick the stats and exact mechanics. For example, start off just by deciding what you want each of the 4 actions for a model to do. For example, you want a buff, a projectile or a blast, etc... There's actually a great article that Beermonkey put up on the subject. If you haven't seen it, it may be of use.

viewtopic.php?f=10&t=1273

In regards to Shred's team power, take a look at the examples of the current supremes. Few, if any, are an actual action. Sonata of Slaughter looks a lot like an action in that it's combinable and has an AP cost. I'd suggest using it as the basis for one of his powers instead.

It also looks potentially a little unbalanced. Most powers that offer a buff only offer a +1 or +2, which is already significant in a game that relies on a roll of a D6. Not to mention, from a tactical point of view, if he hangs back 5 inches behind the rest of his team, he'll be pretty safe from the enemy and can boost your entire team by +3 after 3 rounds. I think the idea is interesting, but again, look at other supremes as an example. Solar's buff only benefits nature supremes (friends or foe) and only offers a +1 within 4 inches. Sgt Bale Gives +1 (and fire) to allies within 3 inches, but only against Non Living targets, and the power itself shuts off if it hits a hero or hero/villain model.

With each idea you write down, you're getting closer to being able to try and field these guys.


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 3:08 pm
User avatarMortalPosts: 16Location: PrestonJoined: Mon Jul 02, 2012 2:04 pm
Ok so i've had a while to think over the powers for my superhero team and i've come up with the following - obivously these are my first attemtps and might have some balance issues (hopefully not) so any comments/suggestions are welcome

here we go:

SHRED

1 Seek and Destroy (PR :ENG vs :DEF Rng 4/AP 3)
Enemy supremes do not benefit from cover against seek and destroy

2 Symphony of Destruction (PR :ENG vs :AGL Rng 8/ AP2)

3 Heavy Metal Thunder (SBL3 :ENG vs :AGL /AP3)
All Mechanical supremes/minions damaged by Heavy Metal Thunder suffer from Aftershocks 1

4 Sonata of Slaughter ( :SPT /AP 5)
All Friendly Supremes from The Monsters of Rock faction gain +1 to :ENG and :STR opposed rolls while within Shred's :SPT range. Shred may not make any other actions while Sonata of Slaughter is in effect. Sonata of Slaughter lasts until the end of the game round

Team Power: Turn it up to 11
Shred adds +1 power up Die to the team pool

WAIL

1 Primal Scream (PR :SPT vs :MND Rng 8/Ap2)

2 Siren Song (Au4 :SPT vs :MND )
Enemy Supremes attempting to activate within the Aura, or moving into the Aura must make an Opposed Roll. If this roll is lost, they take no damage but suffer -2 to all future Opposed Rolls made while in the Aura. Siren Song lasts until the end of the Game round. This power cannot affetc non-living or mechanical enemies.

3 Fade to Grey ( :SPT AP4)
Wail gains Spectral and Blend 2 until the end of the game round

4 A Voice in the Dark ( :SPT AP5)
All enemy non-exclusive minions within Wails' :SPT range act as if contolled by Wail untill the end of the game round. they may make actions as normal using the controlling players AP pool

Team Power Battle Hymn
All friendly supremes within Wails :SPT range gain +1 to Opposed Rolls against sources of damage from :SPT or :MND


THRASH


1 Fist of Metal ( :STR vs :DEF /AP4)
Thrash sacrafices all strike actions in order to make 1 attack at +2 to the Opposed roll, and gains Super Damage 3

2 Battery ( :STR vs :DEF AP 3)
If Thrash damages his opponent with this attack, he may continue tro make attacks at -1 to the Opposed roll until no damage is dealt

3[ b]Harder than Steel [/b]( :STR AP2)
Thrash gains Absorb 2 and Deflect 2 until the end of the game round. Thrash must sacrafice a movement action to use this power.

4 Appetite for Destruction ( :STR vs :DEF /AP 3)
Thrash makes 1 attack against any scenery piece or building and gains Ram 3

Team Power Maximise the Rider
Thrash adds +1 Resource point to the team pool

so thats it so far, any suggestions??


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PostPosted: Tue Jul 24, 2012 5:45 pm
User avatarImmortalPosts: 1161Location: Montreal, CanadaJoined: Tue May 12, 2009 4:23 am
Very cool! Try them out and see how they play!

One more comment:

4 A Voice in the Dark ( AP5)
All enemy non-exclusive minions within Wails' range act as if contolled by Wail untill the end of the game round. they may make actions as normal using the controlling players AP pool

I see what you're trying to do with this one. It's definitely cool, but think about it... you're spending 5 points to basically shut down all the minions within a certain range. That's cool, but it's a lot of AP to just shut them down. Not to mention, if you want to make the minion do something, you need to pay for that too...

You might want to consider a cheaper action, but one that also affects less minions.

:) Let us know how they do on the table.


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